Templates - How to use them and what I need out of them

[Alan_SP]

I created template namespace, created template and tried to use it, but it's not what I need.

When I created template, I get text just repeated from template, without ability to edit it.

I need something like this:

Let's say I want to create cookbook full with recipes and I want to have uniformed headings in it.

So I want to create a template to be used as base of every cook recipe in my cookbook and that template should be editable, i.e. it should be some kind of form, or something like that. So user can use preexisting headings and just fill content in them.

For example:

Name of dish

Ingredients

Food preparation procedure

Serving advice

Images of dish

Recipe variations

Something like that, and after user choose it, that he is able to edit it.

Can I do that and how? Templates now isn't editable, or I could find out how to make them...

[Alan_SP]

Please, any info about setting templates for our articles in this way? Or if there's option named differently that we should use?

[pegasus]

I'm assuming you are already using {{{params}}} to create "blanks" for your users to fill in. Currently these must be filled in manually using param=text when you call the template.

Inserting a template or creating a new page doesn't open up a form that lists all the available blanks. This is a goal for VaultWiki 4 but it's not currently possible.

[Alan_SP]

Ok, I understand it now and managed to create template and article created with this template.

It would be great if you manage to have different kind of templates, something like prefilled list of BBcode tags, that would work like someone just paste them in article. Now article created with template isn't editable, I mean, sections created within template aren't. I think that having fully editable templates would work much better, at least having options that sections created with heading tag are. Here's my example:

Template:

Test template.

Article name

{{{1}}}

Descritption

{{{2}}}

Discussion

{{{3}}}

And here's article:

[TEMPLATE]test
|1=text1
|2=text2
|3=text3
[/TEMPLATE]

But I couldn't edit text1 like sections that are created outside template. This makes templates (I mean, this kind of templates) useless for purpose I need them. I know that this kind of templates has it's own use and may be very useful, but for different purposes.

Do you plan to have system of templates with ability I need? For now I would made templates available for manual copy and paste for my users, but it would be great if there's also this kind of templates and that they are fully editable.

[pegasus]

We have tried this is the past and it doesn't work. I won't go into specifics, as it's very technical, but it has to do with trying to edit/save something that's created from multiple sources. After the edit, it can become impossible to tell what is from what source since you've made changes. Because of this you always have to (at least) switch to the Edit tab to change a heading that may be from somewhere else.

If you name your parameters something other than 1, 2, 3, it will make it easier for your users to make changes.

[Alan_SP]

Well, the main problem is that sections aren't editable easily, i.e. they aren't editable at all.

Did you try just to fill new articles with premade contents? I admit that I don't know much about programing but the process I see in my head is:

1. Admin or users with enough rights create template with some text (of course, text can have BBcodes in it, but BBcodes are just text before they are parsed).
2. User in process of creating article chooses first which template (kind of template I'm speaking of) to use, or not to use any (create blank article).
3. This text is just copied in a new article, but it's just plain text (at least from programs point of view, never mind that it has BBcodes in it). As I would paste it from somewhere else, I think you could program somehow that text would be inserted in article. And not some object, code construct, just plain text.
4. User fills that text with contents, as users do.
5. When user saves it, text gets parsed, as usually.
6. Now we have wiki article with working template, correctly parsed, someone else could edit sections and whatever else.

I think the key is that you treat my kind of template as plain text whole time and let parser do it's magic when time for parser to do its magic comes.

As I said, I'm not a programmer, but that's how I see it and I think that there are ways that enable you to put some predefined text (of course, admins and users with sufficient rights are responsible for text's meaningfulness) first and let parser to create wiki article later.

[pegasus]

This is a different idea than the way templates are currently used. Currently templates are evaluated for each article when the article is parsed (not when the article is saved). This means that there is a discrepancy between the saved version and the article's appearance but it allows you to change the template separately and the article would be updated. For many articles that share code, this makes it possible to update them all at once, and was the main reason for templates existing.

The way you propose is slightly different in that you essentially COPY the content of the template into the new article and then save it that way. Subsequent views and edits show no memory that the template was called, and it's up to editors to keep the format updated on a per-article basis. This is a different kind of convenience in that the article starts in the right format to help new users along, and all the text can be modified from a single editor window.

I suppose that when we add the feature when users can create articles based on a template, it would be an option whether to call the template or copy its plain text. Please add this suggestion here, so that we make sure to add the option: http://www.vaultwiki.org/issues/1291/

[Alan_SP]

As this calls for different kind of template, I think that they should have different names. Let's say that we can call it drafts, as this is not finished article, but just draft of the future ones.

Also, user should be able to choose drafts somewhat similar like they now choose thread prefix (as starting wiki article is like starting thread). Only problem is, can you program that draft be erased if user changes draft after he sees that it isn't the one he wanted to use, and replace it with new one, or none, if user chooses so?

If it's possible, we would have dropdown list of premade drafts and as we choose them like we now choose thread prefixes, they would be put in text area. After user is satisfied with chosen draft, he would go and start writing article.

Even if you couldn't made drafts to be erased and replaced in text area with new ones just by changing what draft is selected, user could use 2 step process, first to choose draft (or no draft), drafts could have description (so users would know for what purpose drafts are used), and after he chooses his draft, confirms selection and goes to writing article.

We could also have options that some namespaces (or how would wiki zones be called as I read you'll drop namespaces) have drafts (maybe even preselected ones) and some are without drafts.

[Alan_SP]

This way we would have templates and drafts. I would really like to have drafts.